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Troop movement over open ground - easy prey?

MessagePosté: Jeu Avr 24, 2008 8:42 am
de Tichy
Walking over open ground under enemy fire is something no player would ever think about in ASL. Especially if MG is present. Assault movement is standard form to make slow and protected progress over open ground, backed up by use of smoke it is even relatively safe.

In ASL, smoke gives partial cover (hindrance), but does not protect entirely. In Landships we may assume troops using assault move as standard form of movement and it makes no difference for defensive fire if footmen have been laying low for the turn or walked across the field - at least not until IM is introduced. In L! smoke makes footman immune to fire in a sense that footman may walk across no mans land without fear of being shot to pieces. As it may be difficult to see the unit on smoke, it is far from impossible especially on close quarters if opponent is moving.

How about close combat in smoke? Is it more difficult for attacker to find the defender? Does defender receive an advantage over attacker as their position is not clearly revealed? Defender is hardly surprised if concentration of smoke follows by assault.

IM brings forth idea of moving troops being easier to spot and hence they are more likely to get shot. By those means, smoke should give bonus to hide under but should not affect fire in any way if troops are spotted.

MessagePosté: Mer Avr 30, 2008 9:53 am
de Tichy
Infernal machines changes the smoke to be hindrance instead of complete block for LOS (+3 modifier, if troops move trough it is only +1) - which is very realistic.

MessagePosté: Mer Avr 30, 2008 9:58 am
de santino
Is the number of hindrance hexes taken into account ( giving a cumulative drm ) ?

MessagePosté: Mer Avr 30, 2008 10:10 am
de Tichy
Not additionally to the fact that it is harder to see units which are further away. Eg. in distance of 2 hex, in fair weather you see if you roll D10 9 or less. Add smoke modifier to the roll.

On range of 5 you need to roll 6 or less in fair weather, add the smoke modifier to the roll.

In fact, I have to check from the rules if it actually is possible to see trough two or more smoke hexes.

Edit: I have checked the rules, they do not specify more than (target in smoke). This opens question about smoke shot between defender and attacker.

Two possible solutions:

1) Modifier is +3 per hex of smoke.
2) Sighting is not possible trough hex filled with smoke. Eg. if smoke barrier is generated, you can only see the units in the edge of smoke, eg.

Units in smoke can not fire out.

MessagePosté: Jeu Mai 01, 2008 3:08 pm
de santino
Aren't also forward observers easy preys ? Shoudn't they remain invisible until they move or someone moves adjacent ? Or at least be given a specific column in the detection table ?

MessagePosté: Jeu Mai 01, 2008 4:59 pm
de Tichy
This has been in discussion someplace but I can not recall where. FO:s do not have to be hidden placements event though it would make them less vulnerable against artillery barrages.

However, IM introduces LO (Liason Officer) that actually makes more sense as FO is not actually the most forward officer in observer duty.

We also have to remember that Liason Officer and Forward Observer both have very high morale rating (5).

MessagePosté: Jeu Mai 01, 2008 5:09 pm
de Tichy
Addition to previous one, artillery chain of communication is following:
LO (observing the target) signals to FO (manning telephone) who then in turn calls artillery to make FFE for desired target.

This places FO actually behind attacking troops and hence relatively safe.

I'd have to play more to form opinion about the FO/LO vulnerability.

MessagePosté: Jeu Mai 01, 2008 5:16 pm
de Arnauld
Tichy a écrit:I'd have to play more to form opinion about the FO/LO vulnerability.


:roll: I guess I'll have to learn some another rules for our next game :roll:

:lol:

MessagePosté: Jeu Mai 01, 2008 5:57 pm
de santino
FO or LO, it should not be possible to concentrate easily fire on them, especially by using a well known ASList trick... Arnauld shoud guess easily which one :lol:

MessagePosté: Jeu Mai 01, 2008 6:03 pm
de Arnauld
santino a écrit: Arnauld shoud guess easily which one :lol:


No ! I HATE ASL !! :twisted:

MessagePosté: Jeu Mai 01, 2008 6:13 pm
de Tichy
Well, Landships is not ASL - Well, I have some mileage in that too.. Rulebook is not written for lawyers like ASL, nor it has 300 pages unlike ASL.

Sometimes common sense is called, even if it does not read so in rules.

MessagePosté: Jeu Mai 01, 2008 6:28 pm
de santino
Sending a bunch of smoke to blind too easily spotted FO is common sense... and one of Santi's favourites jokes ! :twisted:

MessagePosté: Jeu Mai 01, 2008 6:33 pm
de Tichy
I knew that would come out. :D No surprises there.

Actually Hidden FO & LO placement could be optional rule but on the other hand, once you are 10 hexes away (in L!) to order the concetration of smoke, how much ammo are you are willing to sacrifice (IM #5.9) to get that outcome?

Smoke cost you 5, you have 25 for scenario.

Would that ammo be more useful someplace else? Afterall, FO can move.

MessagePosté: Jeu Mai 01, 2008 6:44 pm
de santino
Well, I don't play Infernal Machines... good answer ? :lol:

MessagePosté: Jeu Mai 01, 2008 6:49 pm
de Tichy
Oh well, no worries about LO's either then. :)